dmg4 Posted August 9, 2023 Posted August 9, 2023 I have acquired a helmet that appears similar to a US M1917, but bears no makers mark or heat stamp that I can find. There are traces of blue paint on the sides of the outer shell, the remnants of which might outline a triangle if you have a few beers and squint really hard. The X-pad for the crown of the skull appears to be a foam rubber with leather covering. Pads to which the leather headband is attached are hard black rubber guled to the inside surface of the inner shell. The chinstrap is elastic, which I have not seen before. Any ideas as to maker, model, and...? 5 Quote
leon21 Posted August 9, 2023 Author Posted August 9, 2023 Welcome to the forum, these helmets were made for the Belgium Army from 1949 - 1952. The shells are not marked but the liners are stamped with all the information you need. Here is an example of how they are stamped. Stamped would read ABL = Armee Belge/Belgissche Leger, ( Belgium Army Issue ). 1949 = Model. XB = Manufacturer ( Xavier Buisset Vilvoorde ). 1950= The year of production. You can find the stamp mark on the liner cross bands, if you look on the British Brodie post on page 10 there is the same helmet with a photo of the stamp mark. 4 Quote
dmg4 Posted August 10, 2023 Posted August 10, 2023 Thank you leon21 for the spot-on ID! The marks you described are exactly where you said they'd be. This is not the helmet I was looking for Is anyone here interested in a trade (+?) for a US M1917 of M1917a1? 3 Quote
dmg4 Posted August 18, 2023 Posted August 18, 2023 Belay that previous comment about not wanting to keep this one. I'm warming up to it. I'll continue the search for a WWI-era salad bowl. 2 Quote
leon21 Posted August 18, 2023 Author Posted August 18, 2023 Yes it's a nice looking helmet in very good condition, I can see why you would want to keep it. Good luck in your search. 3 Quote
Tony44 Posted September 6, 2023 Posted September 6, 2023 Good morning, I have this early brodie helmet from 1915. Seems that the manufacturer/supplier is not common ? "AC3 / EV " 3 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted September 6, 2023 Posted September 6, 2023 Definitely British or commonwealth made, not US, you can tell by the chinstrap lugs, US ones were riveted. From 1917 onwards they used the rubber ring for cushion, not familiar with the codes. Leon might know more. 4 Quote
leon21 Posted September 6, 2023 Author Posted September 6, 2023 Yes we think the Maker mark is for W & E Viener Ltd of Sheffield. 4 Quote
Tony44 Posted September 7, 2023 Posted September 7, 2023 16 hours ago, leon21 said: Yes we think the Maker mark is for W & E Viener Ltd of Sheffield. Hello Leon and GildWiller, As we talked about yesterday, « AC » may be for « Allen & Co » but since this supplier only used « A » on my knowledge, it could be a transitional marking, or anything else, but anyway it should have been applied for a short period of time I guess. 4 Quote
leon21 Posted September 7, 2023 Author Posted September 7, 2023 Yes I would agree Allen & Co seems the most likely Supplier for this early helmet, the same as E Viener Ltd who later dropped the E and only used the letter V afterwards. I must admit these are rare stamp marks that have not been seen before. 3 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted September 21, 2023 Posted September 21, 2023 Here is a new M1917 I picked up, it is getting hard to find stamps/heat codes I do not have yet. This one has an intact chinstrap, but missing the liner, it is stamped: UC 317. 3 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted September 23, 2023 Posted September 23, 2023 Found another M1917m this one is marked ZD 182, missing the liner, but has the chinstrap. The stamp was struck so hard it shows through the other side. 4 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted September 25, 2023 Posted September 25, 2023 Found Another M1917 that I did not have, this one is stamped: ZJ 256, that will put me at 105 helmets so far on the US made ones. Will post images once it arrives. It really is getting hard to find ones I don't have a reasonable price, the last few years they have skyrocketed in prices. 3 1 Quote
aef1917 Posted September 26, 2023 Posted September 26, 2023 ZJ isn't terribly common. WA ZA UB ZB UC ZC ZD ZE ZF ZG XH ZH YJ ZJ L ZM ZN xCCo And there are the weird one-off lots like ZAO and ZC45X. Which are you missing? 4 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted September 26, 2023 Posted September 26, 2023 Looking at your list I do not have any of the WA, UB, L, xCCo or ZM helmets. Got plenty of the others. 3 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted October 5, 2023 Posted October 5, 2023 Found another M1917 helmet, this one has a partial M1917A1 Kelly liner, it has several coats of various paint colors. It is marked ZC 210 3 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted October 7, 2023 Posted October 7, 2023 Here is another M1917 I found recently. It is marked: ZJ 256 3 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted October 13, 2023 Posted October 13, 2023 Found another M1917, missing the liner, but has the chinstrap intact, marked " ZC 250". 3 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted December 6, 2023 Posted December 6, 2023 Hello stuckinmcr, you have a WW1 British made helmet, the British used split pins on the chinstrap bales, whereas US made ones were riveted. The emblem is that of the US Army of Occupation which ran from 1918-1923. It was common for US troops to have British made helmets at the time. I can't really make out the stamp along the inner rim. 3 Quote
leon21 Posted December 7, 2023 Author Posted December 7, 2023 Welcome to the forum Stuckinmer, yes the helmet is British made as Gildwiller said. It dates from 1917 as it appears to have a rubber ring under the skull felt pad this was the year it was introduced. At the same time the habit of painting the unit's formation patch onto the front or sides of the helmet began. The maker stamp could be a miss-stamped HS for Hadfield Ltd of Sheffield who was both Maker and Steel Supplier, there should be a heat batch lot code number stamped after the HS stamp, you could try lightly rubbing fine wire wool or sandpaper around the marks to see if there are any other marks. Take a look on the under side of the liner to see if there is the red war office pattern stamp. Hope this helps. 3 Quote
aef1917 Posted December 7, 2023 Posted December 7, 2023 3 hours ago, leon21 said: could try rubbing fine wire wool or sandpaper around the marks to see if there are any other marks. Doing this might provide information that is of interest to approximately six people on Earth and would significantly reduce the value of the helmet. 3 Quote
Gildwiller1918 Posted December 7, 2023 Posted December 7, 2023 I typically use talcum powder to highlight the stamps, this way is does not damage the finish or remove any paint. 5 Quote
leon21 Posted December 8, 2023 Author Posted December 8, 2023 Yes I forgot about the talcum powder, my memory is not what it used to be sadly. 4 Quote
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