IC 1st class screwback 1

[charlie]

Hi

new here , now a mainly WW1 family collector , Ive been sorting through a few extras.

first one off is an Iron Cross 1st class screwback, curved front, the rear has the male thread and I think it looks like a maker mark 50 on but no marks on the cross and no anti turn spigot.

for the record, it weighs the same as no 2 and back is the same thread so interchangeable. Cant remember where I got it from.

I know its hard without handling but thoughts please

[charlie]

 

second one off is an Iron Cross 1st class screwback, flat front, the rear has the male thread and no maker mark also no marks on the cross and no anti turn spigot.

for the record, it weighs the same as no 1 and back is the same thread so interchangeable. this one came from a German specialist at a UK militaria fair.

I know its hard without handling but thoughts please

[Kenny Andrew]

Hi Charlie, are they both three piece construction? 

[charlie]

Hi Kenny

no only 2 part, the cross and the screw.

I cant see any joins and the screws are not like the others Ive seen on the web with a plate and nut, Ive not tried a magnet on them either yet.

[Eddieq]

It’s very difficult to tell from the photographs, however, if genuine, the second may not be magnetic.

I have one similar, with cast iron provenance (direct from an estate sale in Germany) which is unmarked but made by W. Deumer Ldensheid, unmagentic (as it hasabrass core) but referred to as a 1939 Schinkel version - sunburst backed. It’s scarce and pricey- hence the need to be sure.

Again, not an acid test but don’t like the box on the first one.

Better photos and some photos from other angles than front and back would be useful.

[Kenny Andrew]

If there are no seams running around the edges of the crosses, that is a bad sign.   As Eddie says the box is wrong for the first cross, it's actually a pocket watch box.  Also screw backs were private purchase so it  would never be marked with a 50 it would have an LDO number such as L/50.  So the first cross is a copy and second cross needs better photos especially of the edges and date. Again as Eddie says it does have a Deumer type clamshell however it does not look brass to me, also the date does not look correct for a Deumer it should have the swirly numbers such as the image posted.    

[charlie]

thanks for the reply. will have a closer look.

the dealer purchased one, I remarked to another seller and he said, he would sell you a fake but he wouldnt buy one. that worried me

I know the first box is wrong, its one I use to stop it getting damaged, the second came with the box

[Eddieq]

Don’t like to be the Christmas grinch but without the opportunity of looking at them in hand, I think they are both suspect.

Sorry!.

[Kenny Andrew]

I would concur with Eddie unfortunately