Ross Posted July 15, 2008 Share Posted July 15, 2008 Could anyone out there help me identify this broken badge that came with a job lot of stuff alleged to have been dug up on thec Seelow Heights in the 60s. My first impression was that it could be an imperial German badge though may given the possible location be Russian. In other words I have no idea what it is. Any assistance greatly received. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Posted July 15, 2008 Share Posted July 15, 2008 Looks more German to me, they had various 'Deaths head' badges. The skull is not positioned properly to be the famous SS Death's Head badge. Does not look dug to me at all though. however, photo is very fuzzy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Andrew Posted July 15, 2008 Share Posted July 15, 2008 Ross looks British to me 17th / 21st Lancers "Death or Glory" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Posted July 15, 2008 Share Posted July 15, 2008 Ross looks British to me 17th / 21st Lancers "Death or Glory" I think Kenny has nailed it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted July 15, 2008 Author Share Posted July 15, 2008 I agree, my firs thoughts were the same but differs in the detail eg wreath surround, eye sockets open not closed as in British one and differents nasal septum structure. Ive done a bit of surfing now seems to be hundreds of German WW1 skull badges out there. Will try and narrow it down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Andrew Posted July 15, 2008 Share Posted July 15, 2008 G's the man for British stuff but my gut feeling is still 17/21st ,I haven't seen one with a wreath around it before but there's a good chance they exist ,all the other features are very similar down to the remaining part of the scroll, is that not the remains of a Y at the end of the scroll? I have seen these badges with eye sockets opened and closed.Like all British badges there were lots of variations depending on where and when they were made. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted July 16, 2008 Author Share Posted July 16, 2008 No obvious y, a small dint but lower than than the would be y position on the lancers badge. Why not arrange a Treasure Bunker Roadshow at the shop with invited militaria boffins then we could all get a chance to discuss and handle the rare, weird and downright dodgy pieces that interest us all?? Obviously champagne and canapies would help bring in the crowds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Andrew Posted July 16, 2008 Share Posted July 16, 2008 you never can tell we might be organising something like that soon in conjunction with William Britains toy soldiers. Found out the 17th /21st also served in Germany in the East during the cold war but still can't find any reference to a badge with a wreath but I'm still looking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 Why not arrange a Treasure Bunker Roadshow at the shop with invited militaria boffins then we could all get a chance to discuss and handle the rare, weird and downright dodgy pieces that interest us all?? Obviously champagne and canapies would help bring in the crowds. Bunker roadshow would be fantastic, I'd come to show off some of my collection and assist with pointy things Scotland REALLY needs similar type events anyway. All the militaria shows seem to be down south Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Andrew Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 sounds like a possible future project Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 It does bear a resemblance but I can't recall 17/21 with a cap badge with a wreath. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Andrew Posted July 17, 2008 Share Posted July 17, 2008 Nor can I however I was thinking maybe a pouch badge or some thing like that ,the Cameronians have a totally different style of pouch badge to there cap badge I think it has a wreath, what does the back of the badge look like Ross, is it solid or hollow ? It does have a kind of Germanic look to it though with the wreath but the design is almost the exact same as the 17/21st. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted July 18, 2008 Author Share Posted July 18, 2008 Back of wreath solid. Appears identical metal to front of badge. To add to the confusion the leaf structure of wreat beside skull eye socket resembles that of a wound award though changes to a more oak like structure immediately after the first crossbone. Metal is slightly uneven at this point so couldnt rule out that it might be 2 different wreaths joined ( very well by the look) of it. Broken needle type pin fitting on rear behind skull. Presume too unsightly to have been made into sweetheart type brooch? Any records of badges being taken as trophies and modified to be worn by the vet who took them?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graeme Posted July 18, 2008 Share Posted July 18, 2008 Any chance of getting a better photo? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted September 3, 2008 Author Share Posted September 3, 2008 My photograhic skills not able to provide better photo at moment of my badge. Came across this pic of ww1 imperial tank badge today. Cannot help but note the presence of skull similar to mine but more interesing I thought was the fact that the wreath consists of two different leaf types as does mine. Any ideas????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Andrew Posted September 3, 2008 Share Posted September 3, 2008 Hi Ross, still have not managed to find out anything about the badge , I still think it is very similar to the Death or glory badge, could you post a picture of the back of it ,that should give us a better idea of the nationality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted September 4, 2008 Author Share Posted September 4, 2008 Ok here goes still not great at close ups. Solid back, heavy, well constricted, doesnt appear riveted. Poor photo hope it is of some use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Andrew Posted September 4, 2008 Share Posted September 4, 2008 Hi Ross it looks to me like a British lancer badge on a German wreath, maybe as you said on a previous post a captured British badge , there was a allot of these type of trench art things done during WW1 so this could be the closest answer so far, never seen anything like it before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted September 5, 2008 Author Share Posted September 5, 2008 Seems the most sensible explanation so far. I kinda like the unusual items. Maybe most obscure/unusual item of militaria could be an interesting thread? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 How confident are you with the provenience of the item? I cannot yet find evidence but I'm rather sure I have seen skulls with wreaths from military pin/badge dealers in the USA. And they make all sort of fake/crap/fantasy badges (some quite interesting, comical, etc). What other items was it 'dug' up with? Obscure militaria I would say to simply post under misc. militaria. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenny Andrew Posted September 5, 2008 Share Posted September 5, 2008 Provenance is very important , if it did not come from a good source then it is equally as likely to be from a Hells Angel's leather Jacket Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ross Posted September 6, 2008 Author Share Posted September 6, 2008 Yep I agree. More tham happy with the provenance on this one. Well aware of pitfalls involved with dodgy sources. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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