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leon21

British and Commonwealth WW1 and WW2 Brodie Helmets and Maker Stamps

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Welcome to the forum Jacqiblue,

What you have is a Brodie Helmet type D ( "Helmet Steel Mark 1") and also referred as " Brodie Steel Helmet War Office Pattern".

The Liner was stamped with a Red Patent Stamp which read "Brodies Steel Helmet Registration N0 65199 War Office Pattern

Patent No 11803/16.

The BS = W. Beardmore & Co Ltd of Glasgow and the No 2 is batch number  of steel used.

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Wow thanks for that Leon i will note that down, ,id did take a photo of the stamp ,but i have not loaded it on computer yet, i couldn't find the lead for the camera, the others i just shared straight to face book, but again thanks it is good to have the info.

By the way, there is a name in it under the first layer , it reads C. Prince, but i darn't keep lifting it up and disturbing it as i do not want to damage the lining after it has survived over 100 years, the delicate part is where it is riveted to the steel, i would hate it to part from the main helmet ! that reminds me, i have another Brodie which is marked on the liner Something London, it is a second patter liner and rimmed steel helmet, and is totally unissued and complete, i will photo that one and post it too. after checking the stamping marks if any.

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We're always glad to help if we can, and thanks for posting your photo's they're always helpful.

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   Here's a MK2 Brodie helmet I spotted recently being missold as a WW2 British 1941  Helmet/ D-Day/ Normandy.

   What it is in fact is a 3-Hole Triangle on brim Brodie indicating it was made of mild steel and not fit for combat use

    it was only for Civil or Home Front Services.

   The helmet has a makers stamp mark ( 94 BMB ) for Briggs Motor Bodies Ltd Dagenham 1939-1943.

   So buyers beware do your research first before you buy online especially if you are a newcomer to buying Brodie's.

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Here's a unusual MkII-2C indicating 3 hole helmet made of mild steel and for use by the home front services only.

Has a letter R stencilled on a cloth square and stuck on front of helmet, helmet stamped ESC and dated 1940 which

stands for English Steel Corporation Ltd which was jointly owned by Cammell Laird and Vickers,

It was formed to bring together their basic steel making interests in the Sheffield area but also had a plant in Openshaw

Manchester.

Helmets made of mild steel with holes list

MKII-2A  = 1 hole.

MKII-2b  = 2 holes.

MKII-2c  = 3 holes.

MKII-2d = 4 holes.

And also a photo of a MKII-2A = 1 hole helmet.

 

s-l1600[1].jpg

MKII-2A one hole.jpg

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I've recently purchased a ww2 Brodie helmet or I certainly think it is from that time but the liner is dated from 1952 which tells me it is from a mk3 helmet and the helmet is slightly to rusty to find any makers marks. If anyone could give me some info that would be brilliant.    Thanks

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Welcome to the forum Joe, yes the brodie shell is a mid to late 30s shell, the liner is for the mk3  turtle helmet

which had a deeper bowl shape so the liner does not fit properly in the mk2 plus the piece of x shape rubber is missing

from the liner strap. you could try and sand a small area very gently  with a very fine sandpaper to remove some of the

rust you might be able to see any markings then, but that's up to you. 

   Hope this helps you.

.

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Here's another helmet I spotted being sold as a British Brodie, it is in fact a Canadian made helmet by G.W.S. ( General Steel Wares of Toronto ) 1940-1942.

The liner is made by VMC. ( Viceroy Manufacturing Co of Toronto 1940-1945 ).

here are some photo's.

Canada 1.jpg

Canada 2.jpg

Canada 3.jpg

Canada 4.jpg

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Hello everyone.I bought this helmet today and I m trying to find some information about it.The markings are. "1941  N 30"  I think.

Thanks in advance 

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Welcome to the forum Geortz, the helmet shell looks like a MKII helmet shell, the N30 mark I've not seen before so could have been

made by one of the many private firms during the ww2 period or even by one of the allied country's. I've seen G30 marks on police

helmets before so most likely British made, pity it has no liner.

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Welcome to the Forum Geortz :thumbsup: 

Colin I think Geortz is from Greece, is that correct Geortz?  if so did you buy the helmet in Greece? perhaps it could  be a Greek made helmet?    

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58 minutes ago, kenny andrew said:

Welcome to the Forum Geortz :thumbsup: 

Colin I think Geortz is from Greece, is that correct Geortz?  if so did you buy the helmet in Greece? perhaps it could  be a Greek made helmet?    

You're right!I bought it from Athens.The seller hasn't got any information about it.I've made some research and I found that in 1932 the Greek army purchased a few thousand brodie mod 1916 that later replaced gradually from 1938 by the Italian m38.I didn't find anything about helmet production.

 

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The Greek M1934/39 Helmet was initially produced and tested in Italy, the helmet did not meet their standards and were sold to Greece as bare shells

just before the outbreak of WW2. Due to the sudden onset of hostilities between Greece and Italy, Greece did not receive the total number of helmets

ordered so a minority of front line troops were issued with the  Adrian helmet and British Brodie helmets.

As the war progressed much of the supplies were depleted and the Greek Army increasingly had to use new stocks of British Military Aid, at the last

stages of the Battle of Greece a significant number of troops were using British Battledress and Brodie helmets.

As far as I know Greece did not make any of their own helmets only liners for the M1934/39 helmet.

 

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Hi,

Just signed up as I'm trying to identify a British helmet which I've had for years.  Makers mark is HFU, which is next to WD over a 1 over 1939. Liner had no pad and was held in place with a split rivet. Sized 7 1/4 it doesn't seem to have a makers mark. The chinstrap fixings curve into the helmet rather towards the outside. Inside colour is about deep bronze green outside a kind of blue/grey with a post war Armoured Corps Yellow/red square with - poss 11 H. As the Royal Hussars didn't amalgamate until 1969 I guess that 11th Hussars is possible, but clearly it's had a repaint or two in its life. Do I assume from WD 1 that it is British made? In which case who was HFU? Oh and the rim does appear to be slightly magnetic - which I though they weren't supposed to be at that age?

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Welcome to the forum Dustyvon, the helmet you have was made by William Dodson & Sons of Birmingham who made them from 1938-1943,

The HFU will be a batch code some manufacturers used numbers some used letters.

Below is a photo of a typical helmet stamp mark for William Dodson with letter batch code.

WD. UA. 1939.jpg

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Fantastic, thank you.  That is exactly the WD marking and date.  I'm assuming the outside paintwork is some postwar non military version as  any cavalry regiment would have had the RAC helmet by the time that the yellow/red arm of service sign came in. Also liner does have a makers mark which is Everett Vero and suggests a 1940 issue date for the helmet.  Helmet therefore a MkII and should have the rubber x piece with a small size bolt? Is it likely that the inside deep bronze green type colour is original or would they have been service brown at that time?

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The green is the original colour, the shell is marked WD 1 for mark 1 but was made during the transitional period from 1936-1940 so it would

be classed as a Mark 1*, the mark 2 liner should have the x shaped rubber piece instead of the oval pad but I have seen helmets were it is missing

the liner should be held in place by a nut and bolt and plastic washer, looks like the liner may have been changed at some time, normally  the liner

would be the same date as the shell.

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Excellent - now I know what I'm looking at and even better, the colour that I ought to try and match if I repaint it. I might just try gently removing some of the top layer and see what I find.

Thank you for your help with identification. Much appreciated.

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You can try using a commercial everyday paintstripper, which is applied with a paintbrush, rinse off after the recommended time, this will usally not affect the original underlying paint, as it had a completely different composition to modern postwar counterparts. I did this with 100% success on a German M.42 helmet in the 70s, it had been postwar overpainted outside with a horribly glossy light grey. It revealed an almost perfect rough texture light fieldgrey finish. After rinsing with cold water, make sure everything is perfectly dry before storing, and avoid contact with straps, liner etc.

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Hello everyone,

I'm new in this forum. Congratulations and thanks for the knowledge you share.

I have bought what I consider to be a MK1 * brodie marked with the lettres BMB and the year 1939. The liner is the MK1 * type. This helmet was initially painted in kaki green as it is visible inside the shell and in some moment the exterior was painted black.

I have a couple of questions. I've notice there are various examples like mine which where repainted on the outside in black, I would like to know what it could be the reason of that.

secondly, if my helmet was used in the home front, were this type of shells also used by british regular troops in combat? I wonder whether they had the same ballistical properties than the mk2 for mine was produced by BMB in 1939 and it hasn't any hole denoting it was weaker and so relegated to home front rather than front line.

Many thanks for your aid. I attach a couple of photos.

Kind regards.

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For interest I tried the paintstripper trick on mine and the outside layers came off straight away. The dark green on the inside was unaffected on the small area I tried so I'm assuming that the exterior had already been stripped and repainted at some point. Rightly or wrongly I've cleaned the exterior all over. Two questions if I may for those that might know...is there a reasonably good known match for the dark green colour in BS381c or similar? I'm curious as I expected KG3 to be browner than the colour I seem to have. Secondly, am I correct in thinking that 1939 colours would have been textured on the outside and smooth on the inside?

Once again thanks for any advice you can give.

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I could'nt really say. Maybe some other members in the forum might have the answer.

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